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I’ve complained about the iOS 15 beta of Safari—sorry, I still don’t like it for a number of reasons—but in general, Safari is one of the best apps on macOS and iOS and is by far my favorite browser. I’m very grateful it isn’t Chromium. If you haven’t used it in a while, try it.
— Quinn Nelson (@SnazzyQ) July 29, 2021
"Ignoring standards like this does not help the web evolve more cautiously - once these features have been stable for years in every other browser they can't be changed anyway."
— Louis Gray (@louisgray) July 29, 2021
Safari isn't protecting the web, it's killing it. https://t.co/nhsyRo6pL6 /by @pimterry
this is an excellent and well-researched post about the current state of browser competition: https://t.co/1G6yS0Os8l
— yan (@bcrypt) July 30, 2021
A long but immensely useful read by @pimterry https://t.co/2AmbI2xmz5
— Karl Groves (@karlgroves) July 30, 2021
Everything here is consistent with structural under-funding, a.k.a. the IE7-11 playbook. https://t.co/ebqS27AmLT
— Alex Russell (@slightlylate) July 29, 2021
Had thought the from a few months back was exhaustive[1], but @pimterry spotted a few more missing Safari features beyond the 3yr window including print events, orientation events, and offset-path. I regret the oversight.
— Alex Russell (@slightlylate) July 29, 2021
[1]: https://t.co/U87Cl4zhLf https://t.co/yDmpqEAiiB
More highly detailed complaints from yesterday that Apple is really harming the web: https://t.co/2zY9gFfRYC
— Stephen Shankland (@stshank) July 29, 2021
"Safari isn't protecting the web, it's killing it" by @pimterry
— Maximiliano Firtman (@firt) July 30, 2021
—Features not implemented are not dangerous
—'Safari is the next IE' is well supported by many bugs
—Ignoring Chrome proposals without engaging or alternative offers, makes the problem worsehttps://t.co/o1T0GVKwGL
Reading that blog post a day after @igalia mentioned its work fixing WebKit/Safari from the outside: "Igalia is proud to have helped contribute to Compat2021 by closing many of the compatibility gaps in WebKit." https://t.co/KGyfr8K0xh
— Stephen Shankland (@stshank) July 29, 2021
Such a good article. https://t.co/sxyqrBWJ0w
— Henrik Joreteg (@HenrikJoreteg) July 29, 2021
This article provides quite the catalog of accumulating damage that Safari has done to the Open Web over many years, but at the same time the perspective of the author misses some key points (and I think that last part needs some digging into). [1/12] https://t.co/ZNUsrgcS4F
— Internet Effluencer ? (@justinschuh) July 30, 2021
? In response to an open question by @jensimmons, I blogged some thoughts about "one-offs" and my troubles with supporting Safari. https://t.co/qkko09FTrV
— Dave Rupert (@davatron5000) July 27, 2021
Safari is the new Internet Explorer but worse. With IE, when Microsoft thought it was no longer strategic to invest in the browser, others like Chrome & Firefox could take over.
— Dare Obasanjo (@Carnage4Life) July 29, 2021
It’s literally technically impossible to compete with Safari on iOS. ?https://t.co/yL3FZCG2fF
“Safari isn't protecting the web, it's killing it” — really well-written critique of Safari’s development, likening it to “the new Internet Explorer”: https://t.co/6ZUCWF5Sh9
— Nadim Kobeissi (@kaepora) July 30, 2021
We can argue about individual features but the larger point is that the web has historically been very resilient to languish like this when users have *real* alternative web browser choices.
— Zach Leatherman (@zachleat) July 29, 2021
If iOS can run Unity or Unreal Engine—it can run alternative browser rendering engines. https://t.co/IHlGRdt0YQ
Via @feross, it appears the Apple fanboys are so thin skinned they can't accept reasoned argument and instead *are flagging posts to keep inconvenient arguments out*
— Alex Russell (@slightlylate) July 29, 2021
Truly heroic.
(the article is here: https://t.co/J0aBwQUfvG ) pic.twitter.com/8e6UDQYu7s
"It's not accurate to describe Safari's approach as protecting the web, and right now it looks more likely that it is making the web worse for everybody."
— Jer Warren (@nyquildotorg) July 29, 2021
The list of "show-stopping" bugs in here contains terrifying issues I didn't even know about.https://t.co/DkSgI9HU4S
“It's exceedingly rare now to see a web feature primarily driven by Apple. Something has changed.” https://t.co/hcYcNpDmjy
— Dion Almaer (@dalmaer) July 29, 2021
Some of us have day jobs chaining the block to the metaverse and have no time for these shenanigans.
— Miguel “metaverse” de Icaza (@migueldeicaza) July 29, 2021
That said, Apple is always right -by definition- so whatever that blog says, is just an attempt at sophistry and I will have none of it.
"If I could ask for anything, it’d be that Apple loosen the purse strings and let Webkit be that warehouse for web innovation that it was a decade ago." https://t.co/o1aD3cshRW
— Stephen Shankland (@stshank) July 29, 2021
There's been a lot of discussion recently about how "Safari is the new IE", and some interesting rebuttals that Safari's approach is actually protecting the web.
— Tim Perry (@pimterry) July 28, 2021
I don't agree: https://t.co/AxH9myR30k
Safari isn't protecting the web, it's killing ithttps://t.co/IVoFQ7eTgp pic.twitter.com/6rORPv2emk
— Feross (@feross) July 30, 2021
Safari is the new Internet Explorer but worse. With IE, when Microsoft thought it was no longer strategic to invest in the browser, others like Chrome & Firefox could take over.
— Dare Obasanjo (@Carnage4Life) July 29, 2021
It’s literally technically impossible to compete with Safari on iOS. ?https://t.co/yL3FZCG2fF
Safari isn't protecting the web, it's killing it https://t.co/x0CkbBoG6R
— Bruce Lawson (@brucel) July 30, 2021
also featuring "Safari is killing the web through show-stopping bugs" eg, IndexedDB, localStorage, 100vh, Fetch requests skipping the service worker, and all your other favourites.
Sort it out, NotSteve.
An in-depth analysis by @pimterry of the impact Safari’s role that Apple decides the browser can play has on the Web. https://t.co/DH9u0AbbXp
— Thomas Steiner (@tomayac) July 30, 2021
This is a hell of a read.
— dietrich (@dietrich) July 30, 2021
And it's not just about Safari. It's about Firefox also blocking web capability progress, and how to manage a monopolistic Google.https://t.co/ygPR4PaNPk
As a huge proponent of Safari and WebKit, this is devastating and damming.
— Marcos Cáceres ?? (@marcosc) July 30, 2021
It pains me, but it's hard to argue with the data. Apple needs to do better because otherwise Chrome will win by default.
Mozilla simply doesn't have the resources to compete.https://t.co/MXfWw5knZF
“Safari isn't protecting the web, it's killing it”https://t.co/Nszqz5dp5H
— Adrian Roselli (@aardrian) July 30, 2021
…by omitting easy safe features,
…through show-stopping bugs,
…by ignoring proposed new APIs.
Good round-up, some suggestions for resolution, & a point Apple is harming Firefox / strengthening Chrome.
見てる: "One-offs and low-expectations with Safari - https://t.co/5MPo322xwv" https://t.co/DhNcV9fsQp
— azu (@azu_re) July 29, 2021
“One-offs and low-expectations with Safari”https://t.co/9LnbAn5jA5
— Adrian Roselli (@aardrian) July 29, 2021
I bump into Safari gotchas in accessibility all the time (not the list bullet thing; that was intentional if undocumented, as typical of Apple, though <dl> support is still poor).
Opaqueness as a Service.
Safari で使えなかったもののまとめやちゃんと動作させるためのテクまとめ。中々共感が深い
— フロントエンド大好きseyaさん (@sekikazu01) July 29, 2021
こうしてみると確かに Safari だけやたら個別対応多い気がするなhttps://t.co/dm0QvYp05H
?? “One-offs and low-expectations with Safari”
— Chris Heilmann (@codepo8) July 28, 2021
? https://t.co/gp8zwpESbj
Excellent write-up by @davatron5000 about the issue with Safari and non-support of CSS features/web components details.
The challenge for @davatron5000's wish here (and mine) is that there's no internal competition on iOS to force the issue(s). A short-term burst in funding won't fix the structural rot:https://t.co/xMSYWW3Pof pic.twitter.com/OBo1laORBG
— Alex Russell (@slightlylate) July 28, 2021
https://t.co/rEiInNGdAF 웹 사이트 매출의 30%를 애플에 내게 하면 각종 피쳐들을 크롬보다 더 빨리 구현할 것임 (웃음)
— minchul park (@summerlight00) July 31, 2021
I’m not in the “killing the web” camp (more in the “neutering the web” or “hamstringing the web” camp), but here’s a post like mine from earlier this week that has a lot more data points that are hard to dispute. https://t.co/Gr2sWYxOmH
— Dave Rupert (@davatron5000) July 30, 2021
Safari isn't protecting the web, it's killing ithttps://t.co/fyAl4xKwYt
— Ophir Gottlieb (@OphirGottlieb) July 31, 2021